Okay, boom, we're live. What's up, Ra? Hey, man. Hey, everyone. Welcome to episode 3. We are back. We are back. Combustible brains on air. Combustible brains on air is back, baby. Let's go. So today we are talking about China. Actually, we are talking about Indians banning Chinese apps and Chinese products, which has happened recently. Kind of unexpected, out of nowhere. So this just happened. And Ra, walk us into it. What's happening? What's happening with the Chinese-Indian situation? So basically, there was a border standoff a few days ago. I think start of May. I'm not exactly sure. And coronavirus, I guess. People are pissed for that also. So I think these two reasons are like all of a sudden on WhatsApp and all the social platforms, there have been a huge surge of ban Chinese related things. So... Okay. Oh, God. I mean, just one small point here, man. I don't think like we should blame China for that coronavirus. You know, fucking viruses are trying to kill humans, regardless of who we are, you know. These motherfucking viruses, they always kill us. So, but that said, you know, Chinese government, please do not invade my country. That's not cool. Yeah, exactly. And don't kill our soldiers, obviously. Yeah, man. Just go. You know, enjoy your, you know, fucking Facebook, Instagram situation. So looks like this is why people are pissed. And it is certainly, you know, like natural to be emotional about such things, especially, you know, if your city, if your town, if your village gets invaded, you know, anyone will be pissed when you're like, exactly. Dude, I mean, I would be fucking pissed. Same here, man. Imagine somebody like, like, imagine somebody walks into your apartment and they're like, you know, you know what, the kitchen is mine. Fuck off, man. The kitchen is not yours. The kitchen is still mine. So fuck off, you know, from my apartment. So don't do that. India is a country, don't invade it. So this whole emotional, this high emotion thing, I don't think it is reasonable for people to get super emotional about these things. Because, you know, at the very basic people level, like you and me level, like we can't really do much about, you know, governments fighting each other, which is basically what, this entire thing is always about. Way beyond our control actually. So. Right. I mean, imagine like a guy that's in, you know, an Indian restaurant. He does not want to invade like a Chinese restaurant and neither does a Chinese guy want to invade an Indian restaurant. You know, Yeah, I think this is not about Chinese people also, I think. And Chinese people have been, I mean, there's nothing against them as such. It's more of the, the way government, the Chinese government handles things internationally. I think that is what people, Exactly. People get pissed off more about than the Chinese people themselves because Chinese people must be fine. I mean, like they must be doing their own job, doing their own grind, whatever. I mean, they must be pretty much the same as we are. Exactly, man. I mean, everybody just wants to live their life in peace. So that said, this is a very real problem. You know, I think I saw this article, the first time I found out about this was I was reading The Verge, you know, not a big fan of The Verge, but I was reading an article on there. Yeah. And it said, because, yeah, right. And it said, you know, there is this app in India, which is called Ban China app. And it was, it was really like poor, like even the English in that app was bad. Like you are China for something like that. It was kind of crazy. Yeah. I never tried downloading it. I think people in, neither did I, I just read this online and people installed this app on their phone. And I believe what it did was it deleted all Chinese apps from their phone. Um, and then at the end it gave you a pop-up saying you are now China free or you're China app free. Oh, damn. No China app found something like that. It was kind of crazy. So I think, um, That is pretty cool actually, to be honest, it's like, it's like you're China free. That is. Live your life now. That is such a baller move. Yeah. Right. And exactly. And I think Google then banned the app because I think that is a violation of their policy, which I guess makes sense. And Google got scared, I guess. And Google got scared. Probably some, some fuckers are probably paying Google off. I, who knows? So. They got scared. So that app got removed. But I think the sentiment has stayed. I think people are still doing this, you know, get rid of China app thing in India. Um, and honestly, like when I started looking into it, like, I don't even know what Chinese apps I have. So I had to look it up. Yeah. There was a list, I think. Right. That was a huge list and I could not identify any. Yeah. I was using none of them. Yeah. I was absolutely using not a single one of them. So. The same here. Yeah. And the only one that I really knew of was TikTok because I think TikTok is a very popular short video app, I think, which is, you know, I think honestly, I think this is, here's my theory on TikTok. I think what happened is all the generation, you know, the new generation Z, you know, whatever it is called, they are actually now pissed at all the millennials for basically spamming entirety of Instagram. So if you're now a super hot, you know, girl or guy on Instagram. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. tiktok where the visual standards aren't so high so because let's be honest i mean instagram has like one of the highest visual standards so dude if you if an alien were to land on earth and they were to scroll through instagram they would be like holy shit earth is filled with fucking hot fantastic yeah fabulous people they would invade earth if if aliens came to earth and they're like instagram represents humanity they would like immediately invade it they're like all of these people are super hot we need all these people on our side but that's not reality and i think instagram i'm i'm sure i've never posted like you know like you know these uh how do you call it there's like i mean you and me we are not influencers right so yeah we don't know all these things but apparently there's a whole like category of filters designed to make you look better on instagram so like it i think it smooths out your skin yeah i think chinese phones also i think give a lot of camera filters and beauty filters and all of those things i think so anyway i think what happened is all these people basically got tired of this bullshit on instagram and they're like we can't get popular here so they started posting short dance videos on tiktok i think they went viral so and then the tiktok with no standards with no standards and they post this tiktok shit then back on instagram so hopefully really like created on tiktok yeah it'll be in an instagram story so that's the only reason i know tiktok but man you know that's the only one i knew but apparently and maybe you know more about this uh we were talking about this offline right we were talking about share it oh yes i had no idea about i had no idea this existed man but apparently you do right yeah man share it is is one of those typical apps which um kind of were one of the first i would say to have wi-fi based um file transfer so before that it used to be always bluetooth transfers right before that infrared transfer if you remember those times so oh my god yeah so yeah so bluetooth was dude you're making me feel old man i i do remember dude we are old so let's not kid ourselves that is amazing that we remember something that most people don't even know i'm sure most listeners to this podcast have no idea what we're talking about um just just for everybody's understanding you have to keep your mind on the phone and you have to keep your mind on the phone and you have to phones next to each other and facing each other the phones used to like like the infrared sensor yeah the infrared sensor should be able to line of sight basically exactly and it used to like literally transmit stuff through infrared in like through encoding stuff through infrared do you remember when bluetooth came along it was like mind-blowing like one song was transferred like one 3mb song was transferred in like three minutes it was like whoa bro not 20 minutes but three minutes like holy shit three minutes holy shit so it looks like this share it these fuckers have now created a wi-fi based thing yeah so share it was one of the first ones to come uh with that wi-fi based file transfer right so it became widely famous in india and i guess maybe china also i'm not sure so lenovo is the maker of that app and um that's not the issue with that the issue with the app is the sheer amount of permissions they take from you so on android literally you ! every possible permission you can give an app on android share it asks that and it's like everything like your microphone your camera your call logs your contacts i mean location every damn thing and people are like next next next next app reading call logs man yeah exactly and it's like people are next next next next next next next and install give me share it and and people like we'll talk about the permissions and privacy in a while but dude people have no idea the amount of permissions that you can give to an app and it's like it's like so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so Like, I mean, that is always, they're like, dude, you're so inconvenient to share things with. I'm like, dude, do you even know the permissions they take from you? Oh, man. And this is the difference between, man. I think this is the difference between, you know, like, I don't think people in the West realize how people in the East use phones. Like, people actually, it's actually different. So, like, here, most of the stuff goes to Instagram and Facebook, you know, whatever, Snapchat or iMessage. But, you know, in India, in, like, Asian countries, people actually like sharing stuff with each other. You know, like, you may be sharing pictures or, like, music. Right, offline things. It's actually phone to phone. Right, not posting it. Exactly. So, there's a big market for this. Yeah. This is just going from one human to the other, right? Like, there is no posting it online, not going through the internet. Like, it's point to point, peer to peer. And I think even for songs and things, like, privacy, like, sorry, piracy, I meant. Like, for, in US, for example, people have been buying songs for years now. Right? They rarely do their cut songs. Like, I think they don't. I'm sure it happens a lot. But it's just the, it's just easier to modify subscription. Exactly. You know. Yeah, exactly. And I think there is also no DMCA laws in India, as far as I know. So, like, people can do whatever the fuck they want. Which, in a way, is like freedom. You know, like, it's true freedom. You can do whatever you want. On the other hand, you face all this bullshit. So, I think the, you know, I think we'll talk about that permission stuff in a little bit. But one point to address here is, you know, the people, I mean, even no matter how emotional you are. And let's say that you, as a human being, really wanted to get rid of all these Chinese apps. It still doesn't make sense. Because you're still using Chinese phones. I think, you know, the Chinese share of phones in India is so high. Extremely high. That it is almost pointless. Right? Like, it's pointless to think that, like, you can simply get rid of Chinese apps. And then you can somehow retaliate against the Chinese government or the Chinese people. Exactly. It makes no difference. And Chinese hardware, right? Especially. Like, there's literally no alternative to Chinese manufacturing here. And if you just count the number of companies that are Chinese. Like, I think BBK Electronics, which will include OnePlus, Vivo, Oppo, Realme. Then there's Xiaomi. Then there's Honor, Huawei. I mean, the list just goes on and on. And if you look at it from the other side. Like, I was actually, before buying my previous phone, I was like, let's see. And this was a long time ago. Okay, this was like two, three years ago. So, I was like, what all? And companies are there who have, who are not Chinese. Like, the companies themselves. I'm not talking about where the phone was made. So, it's literally Nokia, like, HMD. And there was one other, Samsung LG. I think that's about it, right? And iPhone. And iPhone. Yeah, that's different. And iPhones. I mean, this is what I'm rocking as my current setup. I have an iPhone and a Samsung S20. But, you know, these are expensive phones. So, like, if in the more value-based market. Which is a lot of the Indian market. Which is, you know, more value for your money. There is literally no choice to Chinese hardware at this point. So, like, you have to buy Chinese hardware. And the Chinese hardware is actually fantastic. Like, it is genuinely good phone. Like, the quality of hardware they give these days is not, like, you know. There was a time when Chinese products used to be cheap and plasticky and all of that. But now, damn, man. It is refined, well-made. Even iPhone will feel ashamed at times. They're that good. Like, the displays and all, especially. Dude, I saw this phone review on YouTube. It was called Poco F2 or F3 or something like that. I forget. I think it was F2 Pro. It's the new version of the Poco. Yeah, yeah. F2 Pro. And I was just looking at this video. You know, we are techies. Like, you know, we enjoy this stuff. So, I was looking through the video. And this phone was incredible value for money. Like, they had the latest chipset. I think it has, right? Edge-to-edge screen and all. Can somebody Google it? Yeah. Yeah, edge-to-edge screen. I don't know. Let me Google it, actually. Um, let's see. F2 Pro. Pretty sure this fucker has, like, a Snapdragon 865. Oh, it does. It does. Snapdragon 865. I think 6 or 8 GB of RAM. 128 GB storage or something. Crazy. 6 GB of RAM. Or there's a 256 GB 8 GB option. And there must be, like, some 7 or 8 cameras or some shit. Not quite. But there's still 4 cameras. Quad camera setup. A 64 megapixel camera. A 5 megapixel. A 13 and a 2 megapixel depth sensor. Holy fuck. It has a depth sensor. Yeah, most of them are shit, actually. But that's, that's... Yeah, I'm sure. For the consumers, that's like, bro, 4 cameras, bro. Come on, bro. Dude, it's insane. It's insane. And the price on this one, US dollars estimated, is $471. Now, this, hardware-wise, is comparable to a $1,000 iPhone. Easily. Easily. So, you know, because even the iPhones don't have, like, you know, some of the features that these things have. Yeah. Yeah. I think it has, I think, I think it has an infrared sensor, which is a real good troll sensor to, like, turn off TVs and stuff. It is so useful, man. This is... Yeah. And it has fucking Wi-Fi 6. Like, the whole, the list goes on. And a headphone jack. You know, China... And a headphone jack. Fucking headphone jack, man. Oh, God, not those days. I mean, at this point... Exactly, man. It's like, at this point, like, if you present this option to an Indian customer who is already super, you know, super value conscious. I don't blame them. I don't blame that guy or girl for making this choice, you know, buying the Poco F2 Pro, whatever the fuck. Exactly. It's like, okay, cool. Like, right? So... I mean, for most people... I understand that. Like, for most people, buying a, say, a Redmi 8 or 9 or I don't know which is the current Redmi, but say, Redmi 8. Okay. So, the Redmi 8, like, I bought that for my grandmother, actually, like, six months ago. Okay. So, that phone for, like, 9999, like, for 10,000 rupees for a common person does almost, or rather, I'll say, more number of things than a 1 lakh rupee iPhone 11 Pro does because it's way more convenient to use. As in, you can share things, you can illegally download music and play it and it has infrared sensor, 3.5 mm headphone jack, this, that, bigger screen, whatever. Like, point is, for the average user, the, like, Redmi Note 9 will be way better than even an iPhone, right? For what? One-tenth of the price? I mean, that is not... It's crazy. Something you can bargain with. You cannot say that dual price doesn't matter. Dude, 90,000 rupees, the difference is there. No way, man. It's crazy. And just to put this in perspective for people who are listening in the US or elsewhere, this 10,000 rupees, Indian rupees is approximately 80 to, no, no, it's $200. It's 180 to $200. So, it's a $200 phone. So, it's probably not even $200. It's lesser than that. Yeah. It's $70. Yeah. It's maybe, like, $150. It cannot beat that price. You really cannot beat that price. Right. 64 GB internal storage and shit. Yeah. Come on. I mean, I don't even know how they make them that cheap. So, I mean, we should just accept at this point that Chinese manufacturing is here to stay. You can't really get rid of it. And I actually want to, like, separate this, you know, like, this emotional thing from what people should actually be doing anyway. I think we were talking about this, you know, like, some time ago. Like, you know, we talk about permissions a lot on these phones. Yes. And, you know, I think... I think it's super important that people know, you know. Like, what do you think? Exactly. So, I mean, a few minutes ago, we were talking about Chinese hardware, right? How they can make it so cheap. So, obviously, they are doing business, right? So, they have to get the revenues from somewhere. And especially Xiaomi, for example. They have openly stated that they won't have profits from their hardware. Okay. Like, a few... Oh, my God. Did they? Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah. So, two, three years ago, they announced on stage that they are going to cut down profits on their hardware to, like, 5% or, like, 1% or 0% or something like that. Holy shit. So, then the only other way they can make money is through services. Okay. And through ads. Through the revenues from that. And the way they do that is all about... You know, it's all data, basically. It's these days, all these things are about data. Like, all the... Like, for the manufacturer, they just get money once when they sell you hardware. But they keep making money from your daily usage until and unless you use, like, until you keep using... The phone, right? So, coming to the permission... I mean, do you think, like, they sell... Just to ask you one question. Like, who are these fuckers selling all this data to? I guess... I mean, let's say... Who wouldn't they sell it to, right? I mean, everyone is interested in data these days, right? Everyone. Like, everyone from... Including American companies also, right? So, Chinese phones are huge. Like, Xiaomi must be selling the data to everyone, including Facebook, Google, Microsoft. What not, man? And I bet you it must be, like, dirt cheap. Like, I was reading somewhere that, like, your data's value is actually very, very, very low. Like, they... Yeah, I mean, let's Google that. But I think it was, like, super... Yeah, it was unbelievably cheap. Like, I would have paid money any day of the week if all the gadgets were, you know, privacy-focused. And they just asked money. And I would give that money so readily. Like, I'd give, like, what? Thousand? Two thousand rupees? I don't know. Like, per month or something. Whatever it is. Yeah, whatever it is. I would happily pay. Yeah, exactly. Whatever that cost is. Whatever that subscription is. I think it's very small. Yeah. And I doubt it is anywhere more than, like, few... Pretty sure it's, like, $50. Yeah. Something like that. You know, I mean, we can put it in the show notes after, you know. Oh, yeah. We should, actually. Or we can maybe talk about it later. Yeah. Maybe some... Yeah. So, something like that. So... We don't know. We just know it's cheap. Exactly. But, yeah, back to your permissions. Yeah, so, coming back to permissions, basically. So... What permissions... Like, people need to understand that when they install apps, it asks you for permissions these days. Like, on previous versions of Android, it was automatically granted. Okay. But for the past few years, Android has been asking you, the end user, the permissions. And what most people do is... Okay. So... Yeah. Ra, sorry to interrupt you. But let's say I'm a dumb... I'm a dumb user that does not care about... I'm not a techie. You know. Let's assume that I'm... Yeah. When do I... Well, let's say I go to App Store, right? And I want to install TikTok to share with my friends or something like that. Yes. When will I see these permissions? Like, as an end user, when should I be watching out for these things? If your app is built using an old type of application, you will see it while you're installing the application, like, at Play Store level itself. But most, like, 90% of all applications that I've installed are asking permissions as and when you need them. So, when you open the app... Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. There are, like, three, four permissions that the app asks you off the bat. Okay? And most of them are, like... So, what you should do is, firstly, you should check what they are asking. Okay? So, say you're having an app that orders... Sorry. An app that, say, records audio. Okay? And if that app is asking you for your location permission or if that app is asking you for your camera, you know right there and then that that is shit, right? Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Then you should see if... I mean, imagine, like, somebody... Yeah. Somebody telling you, like, you know, I want to record your audio, but you know what? Give me your call log and also your girlfriend's text messages. Maybe you can also give me your camera permission and I can spy on you. Yeah. Maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How about I start your camera every now and then? So it's like these fuckers. So yeah, so I think this is where it matters the most. Exactly. So this is common sense, right? So when you're installing an application, you should like very sparingly give permissions. You shouldn't just go on clicking yes, yes, yes. And you know, like most people I see doing like, just yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. And get me into the damn app, you know, very impatient about it. Like I've downloaded, say TikTok, and I want to upload some shitty video of me dancing or something. And then I'm like, dude, take all the permissions and then let me upload it. And it's crazy. Dude, you know what would be a great fucking idea? Sorry to interrupt you, but I have to interrupt you. You know what would be a great fucking idea? If some motherfucker figures out, you know, an app that gives people privacy focused permissions. So let's say like this app is installed in the background and then you install TikTok. And then this app overlays over your screen and says like, click here. You know, like literally points. Dude, that's actually a good app idea. Right? Yeah. Just think about it. It would be fucking awesome. And like, it just says like, I've detected TikTok. Click here, click here, click here. Boom, you're done. Like that would dumb it down to the point where everyone, yeah, everyone should be able to do it. So that's a really good idea. So until that happens though, make sure you know what permissions you're giving and say you're, so what I like to do is say, I've given permission on WhatsApp for audio call. Okay. Or video call. So after I'm done with the video call, say I don't, I need to call, have a video call every day. So after you're done with the video call, you go in into the settings and you can always disable the permissions that you have given. So all of these, and this is by the way, applicable even on iPhone. Okay. It's applicable on iPhone and Android. I'll talk about the iPhone part in a second. So basically it's not like once you give the permission, you're dead. Okay. So you can always, always, always go into the settings and you see the entire list of permissions that you have given. And at like every, you know, few weeks, I like to do this, even on my phone, even when I know what type of applications I have installed and what all permissions I've given to the apps. I still like to go back into settings every once in a while into apps and check what all permissions I've given in apps. And you know, Android has super important and Android and iOS has come such a long way now that you get a nice consolidated view on both, like say microphone. Okay. So you can check all the apps that are giving microphone permission. So it's not like you have to go in every apps, settings or, you know, every apps page and check that what all permissions. No, it's the other way around. So you can check, okay, microphone, camera location. And this is also important on iPhone. Okay. So guys, anyone using iPhone, I've like heard this explanation from many iPhone users that, you know, iPhone is very privacy focused or, I think it's a very, yeah, I mean, it is generally better than Android from, you know, the factory, let's say. Yeah. But the moment you install Facebook on it, that whole game, that game is exactly leveled. Like you have absolutely no difference between your Android counterpart using the same Facebook app and you. Why? Because you essentially have officially legally given Facebook permission when you install that. Like when you say enable or give permission or something like that, you give Facebook the exact same amount of permission. So this is exactly equally relevant on iPhone as it is on Android. And like PB said, maybe at the, base level, like when you buy a new phone, yes, iPhone is way, way, way better. Like it's not even comparable, like the amount of bloat where Android comes with, it is crazy. Right. But as soon as you put Facebook or WhatsApp or Insta or anything on it and you give the permissions, you are giving the exact same amount of permissions. Then you're fucked. Then you're, so that's the thing, man. Like, you know, dude, like the one thing when I was like genuinely scared, I was talking to this, you know, like person in China and like I had to install V chat to talk with them. And then you're fucked. So that's the thing, man. Like, you know, dude, I had to talk with this, with this person. Oh, damn. And this was on my iPhone at that time. It didn't last. Like, you know, this was maybe for a month, but it was genuinely scary, man. Like the moment you install V chat, V chat can like take everything. I mean, yeah, maybe they have your DNA. They know, they know who you're fucking. They know everything. So maybe not, but, but really they do like, yeah, they do like V chat. It's one of those super apps, right? I think we, we chat is considered as one of those super apps. It is insane. Like you can basically anything that you wanted to do online, you can do through V chat, which means talking to people, paying people, you know, calling people, video chat, cab. Also, I think everything, it's like everything, everything is on there. It's also a social media app. It has its stories. Like they, it's a super, like everything in it. And it says there, man, like it says there's like anything, anything, that you post on there will be monitored and like kept, you know, for a certain amount of time. So the Chinese government keeps, I think, yeah. We chat must be like Chinese government's most favorite app. It is the best app. The perfect way to control that stuff. Yeah. They control, they control their people, man. And the crazy thing is people install this everywhere, right? Like, um, you know, anytime you have to talk to or do business with people in China, like people have to install V chat and you know, it fucks you up. Don't do that. So I would say like, honestly, if you were to install V chat, put it on a separate phone, but don't put your real information into that phone. That's like one of those apps that really scare me. So, um, yeah, it was crazy. So back to this permissions thing, I think, um, the, the point that you mentioned, you know, where like people should go in and check permissions. I think this is still a little bit too much for most people, but that said, you know, use common sense, like don't go give permissions to, you know, like an audio recorder, the ability to read your call, log, or, you know, don't just, or if you use Instagram, but don't post videos on it, maybe don't give it microphone access. Maybe don't give it, you know, camera access. You can still use these apps. It's just that, you know, whatever function that you don't use, turn it off. Uh, exactly. And, uh, the point of going in and checking permissions every once in a while was because, um, so many apps these days cannot function even, you know, having basic functionality, unless you give some permissions, right. And say you have given a camera permission. It does not feel comforting to know that an app that you are, say, not using daily can just turn on your camera at any, yeah, any damn moment, even if it's in the background and you will have absolutely no idea that, that, that app has, uh, actually accessed your camera. Like apps shouldn't, yeah, apps shouldn't. And they won't, I hope, but still, I mean, you have officially given the permission, so it's not illegal also, right? Yeah. You, you're, you are signing off. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're signing off for it. This is one of those reasons why I disconnected my Google home. It just made me, you know, I was not feeling, Oh yeah. I've thrown away Alexa. Yeah. I had bought it when it was new, that echo dot thing. Yeah. But man, I threw it away so quickly. Yeah. I'm like this shit. Yeah. Like they're, these fuckers are listening all the time, so I don't want that. So, you know, get rid of that. The other thing that, you know, I want to address here is, um, you know what people do. So people just, you know, one of the main things people do is like talk to each other, right? Like they want to connect with other people. And I think, you know, most of the people, you know, use I message or WhatsApp or, you know, standard text messaging is still a thing in the U S like literally no, nobody else in the world uses standard text messages anymore. Yeah. But you know, in the U S people with Android phones still, still do it, which is probably one of the worst ways to talk online. Yeah. It's zero encrypted text messages. Like, yeah, I mean there's complete bullshit. And I think like I have transitioned a lot of my friends, two signal now, which personally, you know, I love, you know, I, I mean, of course we're trying me and we are big fans of signal, but there's also like other, you know, um, other friends that are on it now, not exactly like savvy friends. So for people, I think who don't know signal, I think you should also tell what it is about first. Yeah, sure thing. I mean, the first time I found out about signal personally is, uh, from this Edward Snowden thing, right? So Edward's torn. Yes. His interviews to people. I'm like, right. Like I'm like, yo, what is this? Let me check out. Yeah. Yeah. Check it out. So I go download the app and at this time, at that point actually had a shitty UI, but I think it's improved over time. But the magic of the app is, you know, they do a lot of fancy encryption stuff in the background. Some, I mean, maybe one day we'll do like a tech deep dive, you know, that'll be a different audience. But, um, I think signal signal protocol, right? I think something like that. Yeah. It's signal, which WhatsApp coincidentally uses. I don't know, man. I mean, they say they use it. Yeah. WhatsApp source code. Is not open source. So who the fuck knows what they actually use, what they actually change. No way. I would just say exactly. So signal is peer reviewed by very smart people. Um, you know, like smart, like super smart people that like devs, you know what they're doing. I'm just happy that, yeah, they know what they're doing. We don't, but like I trust these people. So my trust is in these people that they know what they're doing. It's peer reviewed and they peer review the source code. They peer review the math that goes behind this encryption, et cetera. But the main point to make here is whatever you speak on signal is end to end encrypted by default. And what that means is nobody, not even signal can spy on what you're saying. So, you know, you might be talking to a friend of yours about, you know, a movie or you might be discussing, you know, something super controversial. It doesn't matter. It's private by default. So that's the biggest point. And the thing here is like, you know, many people say that, you know, like, you know, what, why do I care? Like, I don't give a shit about the government, reading my stuff, blah, blah, blah. Why should I care about privacy? I've not done anything bad here. I've not done anything criminal. So, you know, privacy doesn't affect me. I think that's like a really, really wrong train of thought, right? It's so wrong. I mean, just think about this extremely simple example. Let's say you, let's say you're meeting with your friends, right? And let's say a stranger just comes in and just sits in right in the middle of where you're sitting with your friends, you know, you, you're goofing around, you're talking, you know, you're random shit and not something important. Yeah. Yeah. It's not important. You're not, you know, taking over the world or anything. You're just talking about, you know, fucking Netflix, but the stranger just comes in and sits on a couch and like out of nowhere, doesn't talk to you. It's just listening all the time. Would you rather have that stranger there or not? And that's the thing that we're really talking about here, you know, and these are governments like, yeah, I mean, it just makes no sense for a stranger to be there, you know, like why the fuck should you be there? Like fuck off, you know, like go home, man. Exactly. And that's exactly what governments are, right? That's exactly what governments are. So they're listening all the time. So signal makes that private signal locks the door. Basically it like locks the door for anybody not to come in and it's a soundproof room. You know, you can speak freely. I think that's the biggest thing there. So you signal, I think the, the biggest takeaway, if you, if you take nothing else from this podcast, absolutely nothing else. Yeah. The one of the privacy signal on your phone. Yeah. It's as easy as it gets. Go to the, or play store or app store and just click install. That's it. It works exactly like WhatsApp, except without the privacy. Exactly. Or like iMessage or telegram. It works like any other app. The threshold, like this learning curve is basically zero. All you have to do is just install it and boom, you're done. Exactly. Zero man. And then get your, you know, closest friends on it and just secure your life, man. You know, it's just like, it's a peace of mind. It's a peace of mind thing. Like, you know, when I call Ra, when I call my friends, I call them on signal now. Why? Because you know, it's just better. Yeah. I mean, what, why should I take the lesser, you know, the less better option, right? Like the worst option. Exactly. I can't believe it. And let's just, and let's, and let's just say that, say WhatsApp is encrypted with signal protocol. It is a known fact that the metadata isn't. So like people say that the chats, like that's one argument I keep hearing from, you know, some of my friends that yes, it is encrypted, right? It is end to end encrypted. Let's just see. It is, we have no idea if it is or not, but the metadata about you, it still tells, it tells a surprising amount of things. And for the people who don't know what I mean by that, it means that it like Facebook can record every other action you do on WhatsApp, apart from the actual text. But that is such an important information, like how many times you come online, when you come online, who you are actually texting. It doesn't matter what you're texting, but who you're texting. And you know, this integration is there in Facebook. Like I've seen so many times, like this has happened twice or thrice till now, that I spoke with a completely random person. I got a number. I spoke with a completely random person and I went on Facebook. Okay. And there's like an, and a generic last name. Okay. It doesn't even have to be a specific last name, a generic last name. And I searched that and Facebook shows that person at the top. I mean, if that is not integration, then I don't know what it is. And that is just through metadata. It is crazy. The other thing is like the metadata is just data about data, right? So it's like, let's say, the classic example that's always given is, you know, let's say you call your, let's say you call your spouse, right? And then, you know, you, immediately 10 seconds later, call your, you know, girlfriend that you're cheating on, like, you know, like the wife you're cheating on. And then you make another phone call to another girl that you're also cheating on. Let's say you made these three phone calls, right? Like if, right? Like if you were to, if you were to do this and if somebody looks at it and he's like, okay, cool. First, he calls his spouse. First, he calls his wife. Then he calls his, you know, girlfriend on the side. Then he calls this other girlfriend on the side. Like this guy is up to no good. This, you know, like this fucker is up to no good. He should have used signal. That's basically what comes down to this. PB is not recommending that. I'm not recommending that. He's not endorsing that. But if you're a douchebag, yeah, I'm not endorsing that, but shout out to douchebags, you know, why not? So if, if it's our podcast, if you're a douchebag, who cares, man? Like it's your life, you know, like do whatever you want with it. But especially if you're a douchebag, you signal, I think that's the most important. Bottom line is trying to tell you, you signal. Yeah. If, if you're the kind of person that sends nudes over the internet, definitely you signal because then only, yeah. Though I think that kind of undermines what we have been talking about. So guys signal is obvious, like jokes apart signal is not for, you know, for people who like do these things, like what we were talking about privacy a few minutes ago, like you, you should obviously get about it. Even if you're talking like normal random shit, like about like kids stuff, say Cartoon Network. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It should be the thing that you talk to people about. So the talk with that's the app that you should use. Just don't think about anything else. Install signal, be done with it. That's if you, if you take away nothing else, take this away from this podcast, install signal. So cool. I cool man. I think, I think we, you know, we talked about a whole bunch of stuff, a lot of stuff, you know, that's, I think let's wrap it up. So I think, you know, yeah, to conclude, let's, let's, let's just go through the list. So don't be emotional, you know, and not at all, though it is. Yeah. Don't be, I mean, even if you are, it's understandable, but don't take it out on people. Don't take it out on Chinese people. Don't take it out on any people, you know, like just focus on your life. Don't be focused, have like a specific, like your principles, like I wouldn't do this. I wouldn't do that. And keep doing it for years. It's not like right now there's a conflict in the, on the border and then you do it for like a month and then you forget about it. No, it shouldn't be like that. If you have a strategy, you follow it. Say you don't want to use anything Chinese. That's good. All the power to you. Just don't be emotional about it. Be serious. Don't be emotional about it and do smart things. You know, like it doesn't matter if it's Chinese government or Indian government, American government, people are people, focus on privacy instead. The second thing we talked about is permissions, man. Like Rai explained permissions in great detail. Turn those fucking permissions off for most things that you don't use. Just turn them off. Like just start there. And that one, like that one awareness, like, that tiny awareness itself will make a huge, huge difference, not just for Chinese apps, but literally for your privacy as a whole. Like you should always have that, like those fundamentals down and it's not complicated. I might have made it sound complicated for some people out there, but trust me, it is like one of the easiest things like, and I think OSs are very polished these days. So that shouldn't be an issue. How about this? Like, since you said it's not complicated, how about we drop screenshots of like where people can check permissions on iOS, you know, Android in the show notes, we can just drop, you know, go to the screen, click here, do these things. Or we can do that. Or I can make a raw video of it. That's a good topic. Maybe that's a good topic. I can attach that link. Like we can drop it in the show notes, create a video on it, you know, walk people through this stuff. So video coming soon guys. And then, fuck yeah baby. And then the last thing is permissions. Well, we talked about the signal. I think we missed out on one thing that I, like, I think we were, uh, uh, like something we should have covered is know what you're forwarding. Right. I mean, uh, people just end up forwarding things on WhatsApp. Right. So I think that's one thing we totally forgot to, uh, come on. I think that's a very good point. Like, yeah. So be factual is what you were saying. Like, don't just read WhatsApp forward and be emotional. I think this, this goes well with that. Yeah. That was being emotional. But you read on verified. Don't don't. Yeah. Just verified man. Like go online, do your research, read a book, you know about it, read, try to understand really what's going on, going on as opposed to just reading, you know, some sensationalized news. Super important point. I think we missed it, but yeah, next time. Cool. Then, uh, install signal, man. That's one last shout out to signal, install signal. Uh, if you take away nothing else, talk to your friends on signal. Cool. So this is a episode three. Let's wrap it up. It's been a pretty long episode, man. Almost 40 minutes. Oh yeah. Fuck. But I think it was good. Yeah. I mean, uh, fun. It was a good episode. I had fun too. Cool, man. All right. See you next time, guys. Thanks for all the people listening. So talk to you guys soon. Bye. Yup. See you.